Finalizing Your University of California (UC) Applications

Webinar Transcription

2023-11-15 – Finalizing Your University of California (UC) Applications
Stacey: Hi, everyone. My name is Stacey Tuttle, and I am your moderator today. Welcome to, ”Finalizing Your University of California (UC) Applications.” To orient everyone with the webinar timing, we’ll start off with the presentation and then answer your questions in a live Q&A on the sidebar. You can download our slides and you can start submitting questions in the Q&A tab.
Now let’s meet our panelist. Aaron over to you for an intro.
Aaron: Thanks so much Stacey. My name is Aaron Brown and just give you a bit of my background before we launch into the session. So I worked in admissions for 14 years. My first kind of. A little bit more than half of that was at USC, which was my alma mater.
Um, and started in admissions when I decided not to go to law school about three weeks before law school started. Um, and ended up loving it and kind of making it my career. Uh, and so had opportunities to, to recruit, to read applications domestically, internationally, uh, and left there essentially kind of managing USC’s application evaluation process.
Um, And then wanted to get some experience on the public side. And as a kind of lifelong Californian, the UC system was quite special to me. Um, and so wanted to get an experience there. And so I went to UC San Diego, where I had a somewhat similar role. Um, it kind of on your senior leadership team. Running the application review process for all of their first year, um, and transfer applicants, all 120,000 of them, uh, which was quite a lot of work.
Um, and perhaps because of that, I’m now on the high school side, um, where I work as a high school college guidance counselor. In addition to the work that I do. With CollegeAdvisor, um, at a private high school here in Southern California.
Stacey: Wonderful. Okay. Well, we have a lot of great experience coming your way with this presentation.
Um, now I want to get to know you all, um, a little bit better so that we can get a sense of who’s in the room. There’s going to be a poll that will appear in front of you momentarily. Um, let us know what grade you’re in. Are you, um, Pre high school in high school, or perhaps your parent or somebody supporting a high schooler in their application process.
We want to know more about where you are right now. Um, and Aaron, you know, thinking back to your own high school application process, um, did you were you familiar with. You know, the key differences at that time between applying to the say, the UC’s versus, you know, common app schools. Or was that kind of hard for you to navigate?
What was that experience like for you?
Aaron: Uh, so I was growing up in a, you know, in a kind of public school in a suburb of Sacramento. And so it pretty much was very UC Focus. So we had a lot of Yeah. Great support when it came to the UC application, uh, to non-UC applications, a bit less so, uh, so that kind of required a lot of work on, on my own kind of figuring things out.
And then obviously I was fortunate that my parents were able to help a bit as well. Um, although they were also both grads of, of UC, so, um, uh, definitely much more of a UC focused kind of high school experience. Um, but. was able to figure out both.
Stacey: So, so interesting being an East coaster. Like I was telling you earlier, Aaron, um, it, it was a totally flipped experience, right?
The UC’s were totally unfamiliar and then the common app was much more, um, popular in terms of knowledge base and such. So really interesting to hear that perspective and just who, based on who’s in the room now, it looks like we have mostly seniors and juniors. So welcome. We do have a few freshmen and sophomores.
So welcome to you as well. And there’s some in the other category, whoever you are, um, whatever role you play in that application process. Welcome. for being here. I’m going to turn it over to you, Aaron, to begin the main part of the presentation.
Aaron: Sounds good. Thanks, Stacey. Okay. So, um, what we’ll do for the next kind of 30 or so minutes before getting to your questions, um, I’m going to talk a bit about kind of the UC system broadly, but then mostly spend time talking about the application, which, you know, for those of you that are seniors. I’m sure you are right in the midst of it right now, uh, given the timing of the UC deadlines. And then for those of you that are juniors and younger, kind of getting a sense of what’s perhaps coming your way next year or in the future. So first, what is the kind of University of California system?
So obviously, there’s the public health Higher education system in the state of California. In fact, one of a couple, you also have the CSU’s California State University system as well as the community colleges, the two year kind of associates degree granting institutions in California. There are nine undergraduate campuses.
Located across the state listed there on the slide, uh, Berkeley being, of course, the oldest, the original University of California founded in 1868 and then one a little bit less than 20 years ago at UC Merced, um, sometimes I would get questions, uh, about how do I apply to UCSF? Um, uh, well, that’s just a graduate campus.
That is just for medical school. There are no undergraduate programs. Similarly, Hastings, um, is only a graduate law school. Um, so students might ask about that, but that’s just grad so you can see all of the nine undergraduate campuses listed there on the slide. So how does one apply to them? They are separate.
They are essentially their own beast. They exist on their own application. And that is the only way to apply to any University of California campus at the undergraduate level. They are not on the common app. So essentially, though, that means they have their own kind of common app. So you don’t have to fill out a separate application for UCLA or for UC Irvine.
Uh, they both exist on the same application. You are literally just, uh, in that kind of common, uh, parlance. Check in the box when you’re applying to different UC schools and just paying an additional fee, um, of 70 or 80 per campus, depending upon your, um, status, um, as an international student or domestic student.
There also is a centralized system for support. Um, so obviously kind of like common app, if there are issues with the Common App itself, you would reach out to the common app team and not the individual schools necessarily. Similarly, the same thing is, is the case where the UC office of the president, the ones that run the application platform itself, handle all the support when it comes to the actual application, but review is done by each individual campus, um, and their team of admissions officers.
It’s important to note that, and I’ll talk much more about this in a minute, the UC application, um, for a variety of reasons, is entirely based on self reported data from the student, um, and so it’s critically important that before you start using filling out the UC application that you have a copy of your high school transcript right there with you.
Uh, ideally you have a copy of your high school profile, uh, which is something that your, um, counselors will oftentimes put together that has information about kind of curricular offerings, um, and kind of basic information about, you know, the size of your graduating class, kind of things like that, that you don’t necessarily have to have it, but can absolutely.
Be helpful. And then, of course, um, you know your activities or resume. Um, you know, it can also be your activities section from the common app, but I’ll talk a bit about the differences between the two systems in a minute, but definitely want to have that available for a resource as well.
So what are the main kind of components of the application? Uh, there are more than these three, but these are really kind of the three biggest ones, uh, the ones where you’re going to spend most of the time. So the first is, again, that self reported academic history, they do not ask for, uh, and do not look at transcripts, uh, as part of the initial review of your application that is only done if you are admitted and then choose to enroll.
And in. attend one of the UCs. And at that point, they will then look at, um, an official transcript to verify that what you put down on your own, in fact, matches your, your actual, uh, transcript. Of course, the activities and awards section, understanding what it is that you’re doing when you’re not in class and how do you spend your time?
And then the personal insight questions, which are, in essence, the, the UC, uh, essay responses or supplements and kind of any of the written materials in the UC application are there in the PIQs.
So kind of thinking a bit about, you know, what makes you stand out, um, in a UC application. Admittedly, a lot of it comes down to your academic strength, right? Um, being the flagship public institution for the state of California, and given the application volume that they receive, both from in state students, out of state students, and also from international students, um, How well you’re doing in the classroom is critically important to your success in this application process.
Um, but it’s important to note that you’re going to be reviewed As much as possible in the appropriate context, right? So what was open and available to you at your high school? Um, how are you performing in the context of opportunities available to you at your high school? Those kinds of things. Um, also the UC GPA.
So they calculate GPA perhaps a little bit differently. Um, and they do have an That’s the official way to do it, and that is how your application will be reviewed is the reader will be provided with your official UC GPA. And for some students it might help because they don’t look at ninth grade, they kind of give that give you a pass that’s like a transition year into high school.
And then obviously because of the timing of the application and the fact that they’re not looking at transcripts they’re not really looking at all either. In fall of 12th grade. So essentially, the entirety of the academic piece of your application, um, comes from 10th and 11th grades, and they will also kind of officially cap the GPA at eight semesters of honors or AP courses in a way to attempt to balance the fact that many schools have different offerings.
And so you might have. Way more than eight semesters of honors AP/IB coursework, college level coursework. But in terms of the official UC GPA It is capped to those eight semesters, though the reader absolutely will see those additional courses that you’re taking, um, and kind of assess the rigor inherent in that schedule or in that curriculum.
They’re also looking then closely at the activities that you have, but kind of from the lens of the impact. You’ve made on your school, or in your community, or at home, and then the likelihood of making a kind of similar impact on their campus, looking at the personal insight questions, um, kind of really understanding.
Do they learn more about you? What’s kind of the impact or take away there again? Is there any sort of important context that they need to understand in those questions? Um, and importantly, you control again, pretty much all of this application. There are no letters of recommendation considered as part of this.
No one speaks on your behalf in the UC application. It is entirely coming from.
We got a lot of questions about this. Uh, I was at UC San Diego, um, during, well before and during and a little bit after COVID. Um, and so kind of saw this transition to test free play out, uh, in real time and had to deal with that, uh, as a reader and as someone who trained readers, which was a challenge, but I think they’ve definitely figured it out now.
Um, the UC system is. What they say test free, meaning they do not consider SAT or ACT scores, so many other institutions are test optional, meaning that if you submit a test and you want it to be considered, it will be considered as part of the review of your application. UC’s, you could have a 1600 or a 36, and they do not care.
If you try to put it in, you’re going to, I’m going to put it in, in the additional information section. Hey, I have a 1600 on the AC, on the SAT. They instruct their readers to ignore that and to not consider it. They are not asking for it. They are not looking at it. And technically there are a set of prescribed things from the, it’s a very technical term, uh, BORS, the board of admissions and relations with schools, which is a state committee, et cetera.
That sets. admissions policy for all UC. Um, and they removed SAT or ACT as one of the things that admissions offices were allowed to even consider. So again, even if you somehow put it into the application, they cannot and will not consider it. It’s not part of the application at all. They will, however, if you provide them, look at AP scores.
Um, for AP exams, you may already have taken IB exams, either predicted or completed. If you’re an international student, of course, coming from, you know, say a British system, so you’ve taken IGCSEs or GCSEs. Um, coming from an Indian system, you’ve taken the CBSE board exam, so look at those. Um, international students may need to provide SAT scores to demonstrate English language proficiency.
If you don’t have the, um, TOFL or IELTs, uh, and actually looking at applications, it basically just kind of says this student met international or met English proficiency through the SAT, but the leader does not actually see what that score is, so don’t send the scores, um, not at all considered as part of the review process.
Um, your academic piece comes entirely from your grades and the courses that you receive those grades in. So let’s turn it back to Stacey for another quick poll.
Stacey: Yeah, and that poll is going to pop up right in front of you. Now. Where are you all in the college application process? And, you know, Aaron and I were just talking about the November 1st deadline, which is past, um, which is the early deadline for a lot of schools that do have early action and early decision deadlines now, Aaron, I wanted to take a 2nd, um, to ask you about deadlines associated with the UC schools, because this is a question.
And actually, there’s a lot of questions A lot of myths that float around the grapevine, um, as to when you should actually submit your applications for the UCs. There’s, I know that the application deadline is typically after the Thanksgiving holiday, um, but I’ve heard from a lot of people that you should try to submit before then.
Is there any value to that advice? What would you say, um, in terms of aiming for, uh, the deadline or not with the UCs?
Aaron: Sure. Um, so the deadline is November 30th. Um, and it’s, it’s always the same kind of every year. Uh, they did change the submission window a bit. It used to be that you could only submit between November 1st and November 30th.
Now it’s October 1st to November 30th. There isn’t necessarily any sort of benefit from an admissions standpoint to applying, you know, much before the deadline. Yes, they have started reading applications already. But that doesn’t mean that somehow you have a greater chance of being admitted. If they read your application today versus in February.
Um, that’s not kind of the way that their review process works. So ultimately submit the application when it is ready and it is at its best. I will, however, say that there is a flurry of activity around the deadline and as much as they try to manage that traffic. Sometimes there are issues and outages on the application site itself.
My first year at, um, UCSD, the app crashed on the day of the deadline, which, you know, again, we couldn’t do anything about because that’s central office handles it. But, you know, students were freaking out. Lots of contact. Of course, we let them submit the next day and all of that. But, um, you don’t want to find yourself stressed out in that situation.
If you’re trying to submit on the last day and the site crashes. So I would say try to get it in maybe next week, um, or perhaps early after Thanksgiving. Um, but you know, perhaps try to avoid the 29th or the 30th.
Stacey: Of course, there is also the benefit of going into that holiday break with a little bit of ease behind you.
Right? Um, but I, I wholeheartedly echo that advisement. And, you know, the earlier you plan, the earlier you usually can submit. So, with that, let’s see where you all are in that application process. I mean, we have some seniors in the room, so quite a few of you are actually almost done or getting your application materials together.
We do have some students in the middle of researching. So this is a little bit more formal but um, which makes a lot of sense given that we have some junior and sophomores and freshmen. Um, there’s some of you still working on your essays, right? That’s the big, um, ticket item with your applications. Um, and some haven’t started summer aiming probably for, uh, maybe getting that together closer to the deadline or maybe there earlier in their high school career.
Um, But it looks like we have quite a variety here. So back over to you, Aaron, for the rest of the presentation.
Aaron: Awesome. Um, so kind of thinking about the different actual components of the application as we move into that. Um, so there’s an about me section where you start basically the personal demographic information, you know, things like your preferred name, contact information, all of that kind of stuff.
It does also ask for demographic information and students might be like, wait a minute, I thought they couldn’t consider that even before the Supreme Court decision in the summer. Yeah. Yes. Um, but U. C. O. P. Again, kind of the office of the president will, um, record the data just so they can kind of understand what their applicants look like, you know, how are things trending, how are their outreach services working or not working, um, who is applying, who isn’t applying, who’s being admitted, who isn’t being admitted.
So it’s used kind of on the back end to understand trends, but it is not visible to the reader. Okay. Um, a lot of times also students will see there’s a, uh, a question about parents income and they ask, well, why is that being asked? Why do they need to know that? Um, it really only helps kind of to establish, um, eligibility for certain scholarships and fee waivers.
Um, so be honest, be truthful. It doesn’t have anything to do with the admissions process. You’re fine. Um, it also asks about your statement of legal residence. And so, um, whether you kind of wish to be considered for in state tuition or not, um, um, That doesn’t actually just checking that box. Yeah, I want in state tuition, but you live in Massachusetts.
Um, that’s not how that works. There’s a residency deputy on each campus who actually makes the final determination. If a student is admitted, whether they qualify for in state or out of state tuition. The next section is campuses and majors. And so we’d always get a lot of questions about that. Um, so you’ll select the campuses to which you’ll apply.
It truly is checking a box. Um, a common myth that I heard is that somehow the schools all talk to each other until they understand, oh, you’ve applied to all or only to Berkeley or just Berkeley and LA, or you can only be admitted to either Berkeley or LA. None of that is true. Each school handles their admissions process on their own.
They do not share information about their applicant pools. So when I was reading at UCSD, I didn’t know if a student had also applied to LA or Berkeley. Uh, and honestly, I didn’t care, um, apply to as many campuses as you want to. And as you were interested in, you know, going to, um, sometimes students who were, you know, kind of top in their class in California, you know, might also think, well, like I have that admissions guarantee for the UC, right.
Okay. So if I only apply to Berkeley, then I’m guaranteed to get in. Um, they might turn around and say, well, if you apply to, if you add an application to Merced, we’re happy to take you there. Uh, but that definitely does not mean you’re getting it to Berkeley. Kind of a thing. Um, all campuses now at this point, allow for the opportunity for you to select a first choice major and then an alternate or second choice major.
Um, the most selective campuses. We’ll read. With your major in mind, um, and so they will consider, okay, you know, you’re applying to engineering or computer science. Like, do you have the right prep for that? Um, you know, have you taken, uh, have you been involved in activities that indicate an interest or ability to succeed in engineering?
Right? And so the major to which you apply does, in fact, at the most selective campuses have a prep You know, bearing on your likelihood of being admitted. At some of the less selective campuses, that’s not as much the case, where they read your application as a bit kind of independent of major, and then they turn around after they’ve determined who they want to admit, and see where they can put them into majors.
You can always apply undecided. If you are undecided, but you shouldn’t use that as a way to kind of like backdoor into one of the institutions and then like, well, I really want computer science, um, you know, at UC San Diego, but I’m going to plan decided. And then when I get in, I’ll just go and be a computer science major.
not how it works. Um, they, they are essentially as competitive for internal transfer as they are when you’re applying for the first time as a freshman. So, um, apply to your first choice major that actually is your first choice and give yourself an alternate or a second choice, perhaps in a different, you know, different but related discipline or faculty, um, to kind of give the admissions committee, um, the opportunity to consider you as widely as possible.
Then also in the application, you’ll have to rank if you select. to apply to UCSD, you will have to rank the colleges. So, um, that institution in particular has chosen to kind of set themselves up in a college system, kind of on the model of like Oxford or Cambridge, um, if you’re familiar with that, where the school, you know, all 32, 000 students are split up into, um, eight different, residential colleges.
And so they have different kind of themes. Um, you know, they have their own kind of traditions. It’s where you live in your first two years. Um, but importantly, they also have different general education requirements. So you can be any major in any one of the colleges. That doesn’t matter at all. But as an example, Revell College is very STEM focused in their GEs.
You could be majoring in sociology and you still have to take calculus. Um, so make sure that you read the fine print and look at, okay, what are the general education requirements being asked of me in these different programs at the different colleges? Um, which one kind of do I resonate with? Do I want more of the international kind of focus of, you know, ERC for Eleanor Roosevelt College?
Do I want more of the kind of environmental focus of Muir? Um, kind of picking a social justice of Warren. You’re kind of picking which one it is that you want.
Alright, so the academic history, that’s the meat of the application. This really is also the part that you can easily make mistakes, um, and it was really important to be accurate. So, um, what you will do is kind of add your high school, um, which, uh, is the easiest if you’re at a school in California, but generally schools in the U.S. are pretty easy to find, and add international schools admittedly can be a bit of a challenge sometimes. You would input the kind of GPA scale that your school uses, which is why it’s helpful to have a copy of your school profile next to you when you’re filling this out. Um, the dates that you attended, all of that.
And then importantly, you’re going to enter every course that you took in high school year by year. Um, so starting with, you know, ninth grade and then 10th grade, et cetera. Um, so each course and then the grade that you received in that course. California students, you have it easy. Um, your school’s A through G course list, which is kind of the UC approved, um, college preparatory coursework is already added.
And so you just kind of check off like, yeah, I took these courses this year, whatever I put in the grades, um, for out of state students, international students, you have to actually just add it. type it all in. So sorry, a little bit more work for you. Um, and then you kind of select which UC A through G area it kind of most, um, closely falls under.
Um, and that’s fairly straightforward, but, you know, ask a counselor or reach out to any of the UC campuses with questions. Again, it’s really important here that you’re accurate so that If you say a school, a class is an honors or AP class that it is in fact the honors AP class that you’re not tempted to give yourself an A minus when you were right on the cusp and you actually got a B Because again, if you are admitted, they will ask for your official transcript, and if it does not match, they, you know, they’ll reach out and ask perhaps for you to clarify and give yourself an opportunity to kind of, you plead a mistake.
But if there’s widespread issues across an application, it happened every year I was at UCSD, we would rescind the admission of the application. 15 to 20, if not more students, um, who had misrepresented their academic record in the application. So make sure that it’s not you.
So the activities and awards, um, is, is fairly similar to Common App. So if you’ve already submitted a common application somewhere by November 1st, then you’re gonna be pretty much set to just kind of move some of this over to the uc application, copy and paste. And, and you should be good to go. Um.
Essentially what they want to know is, you know, again, what are you doing with your time when you’re not in school, when you’re not in class, how do you spend your time, whether informal activities or informal things? Uh, you know, are you caring for a sibling or grandparents? Uh, are you teaching yourself guitar from YouTube videos?
Uh, you know, they want to know it all. You have space to enter 20 different things. Um, and so some students are like, wow, that’s so much more than the common app. Well, it’s a combination of activities and awards and employment and everything else. So, you know, how common app gives you five awards or honors and 10 activities.
This is giving you 20. So it’s 20 instead of 15. So yes, you have five more things or five more spaces that you could put something down if you want to use them. You absolutely do not need to feel obligated to use all 20 spaces. We absolutely admitted students every year who did not have all 20 full. Um, and it’s really ultimately about.
You know, kind of how compelling those things are versus the number of them. Similarly, kind of to that point about quality versus quantity, um, you actually do have quite a bit more space to describe what you did, uh, in those activities or what your leadership position is, et cetera, you have 350 characters compared to the common apps, 150.
Um, however, if you’re like really happy with what your common app activities were or how they were described. Sure, just copy and paste it over. Uh, again, as an admission reader who was in charge of 120,000 applications, um, I can assure you our readers would be happy to read less. Um, there, I kind of basically the process worked that they have to read 65 applications a day.
Um, so if each person, Part of, um, the writing in your application is not adding value, then it’s wasting their time, right? So, um, yeah, you can write a ton for all of these different activities. Well, a ton, 350 characters, but, um, you can write much more than the common app, but again, you don’t need to feel compelled to.
However, if one of your Common App activities, you really were struggling to get it down to 150, and you feel that you just didn’t capture at all, um, you know, kind of the depth of your engagement in a particular activity, this does give you the space to elaborate on that a bit. Make sure that you spell out acronyms, uh, you know, things that a reader might be unfamiliar with.
You know, they didn’t go to your high school, they didn’t grow up in your community, so be sure to express that. Um, because again, the reader doesn’t have the time to Google, what did you mean when, when you put in that acronym? So spell that all out for them. Uh, and that’s quite helpful.
Okay. And then the last piece is the personal insight questions, the P I QS. So these are the only written material. in the UC application. Um, there are not school specific supplements at the UC. Uh, so if you apply to multiple schools, they will receive the same PIQ responses. There’s not a way for you to customize them, to change them.
So I really would recommend not mentioning specific UC schools by name. in the PIQ. That’s not what they really intended for. Again, these are not why UCLA or why, uh, UC Santa Barbara. It’s much more broad about kind of who you are, what you’ve done, your interests, those kinds of things. Um, now if you’re only applying to one UC, sure you could, but again, the types of questions they’re asking are not really even designed to get at that kind of response.
So there are eight different prompts that you have the opportunity to choose from. You will write On four, eight prompts, you choose four. You are allowed 250 to 350 words per response and all prompts are weighed equally in review of your application. Um, so sometimes students are like, well, surely one of them is better than others, right?
No. Whichever one, uh, you feel inspired to talk about. If you don’t have something to say on a particular prompt, then maybe don’t choose that prompt. Um, truly, they all are equally fine. The writing in the PIQs is very much different than in the PICs. absolutely than your common app personal statement and then perhaps even different than some of the supplements you might be preparing for common app institutions.
They want you to approach your response to the PIQ questions as if you were almost having a face to face conversation with the person reading your application. So if an interviewer asks, tell me about an example of your leadership. And how you demonstrated that over time, you wouldn’t start with, as I drove the basketball down the court, sweat dripping down my brow as the clock ticks down.
Just, that’s not how you would answer an interview question in real life, right? When you’re talking with that person across the table from you. So they want kind of the factual, what did you do? How did you do it? What does this tell us about you? Uh, again, any language that you’re using in the application.
should add value. Um, so the kind of flowery, descriptive, fluffy language. Take that all out. If it is not explicitly answering the prompt, it’s not adding value, uh, when they read the application. So it’s a very different style. It takes students getting some getting used to, um, I’m reading a lot of UCP IQs for the students, uh, at my high school right now.
And so often I’m like, no, no, no, this is not going to work. Um, again, answer the question in a very straightforward way. Ultimately what they’re wanting to know, did the student, uh, The PIQs provide insight. It’s right there in the kind of, you know, the name for what they are, right? Um, did the reader learn something more about you?
Did it add value to your application? Um, that’s what they’re looking for. There is an optional, um, additional comments section, um, up to 550 words, kind of like additional info in the Common App and really was used in that way. You do not, you should not kind of, you know, copy and paste in your Common App essay, um, here, but it’s really a way to kind of, um, perhaps provide clarification if it’s needed, uh, you know, did you have a particular challenge, um, Uh, some, you know, poor grade, something like that that you want to explain, um, you know, were you not able to really highlight one of your activities appropriately and 350 characters, things like that, but also again, just because it’s there doesn’t mean you need to do it.
If you don’t have anything to say there, we admitted plenty of students who didn’t have anything in the additional info because they didn’t have anything to share. The PAQs and their activity summaries absolutely captured who they were, and that was fine. There’s also an additional um, academic comments section, and oftentimes students will put things in there about kind of unique grading systems at their school, or maybe they’ll say, hey, my high school only allows, uh, you know, AP’s starting junior year, and you can take two as a junior and four as a senior.
And that kind of information might help the reader understand, oh, okay, yeah, like, compared to this school down the street, the student only has six AP’s, um, but that’s actually what is expected of them, right? Uh, so that’s why, again, having that school profile might be useful to have next to you to help give the reader context since they don’t have a letter of recommendation.
To do that. Okay. So look at that. 35 minutes minutes as promised. And now time for Q&A.
Stacey: Thanks so much, Aaron. So that is the end of the presentation part of the webinar. I hope you found that information to be helpful. I know I certainly did. And remember that you can download the slides from the link in the handouts tab.
So now we’re going to move on to the live Q&A. I’ll read through the questions you submit in the Q&A tab, paste them into the public chat so you can see and then read them out loud. Before Aaron, um, gives the answer. So as it has up to if your Q&A tab isn’t letting you submit questions, just double check that you join the webinar through the custom link in your email and not from the webinar landing page with that.
Let’s go to our first question. It seems like we have a few here in the chat. Um, the 1st is specific to the activities section. Is there a specific order recommended for the activities? I know on the common app, it’s usually an order of importance. Aaron, what is your experience with that?
Aaron: Yeah, I would broadly say stick to that as well.
Um, though I will also say the way that the activities are presented to the reader, they kind of Separate them by the different kind of drop downs that they are in essence. So like employment is all presented in one section and then extracurricular activities is all presented in one section and then honors and awards is presented in one section.
So sometimes, you know, I had students are like, Oh, my gosh, I realized that these are all jumbled and there’s no order to it. That’s okay. They’re going to pull it out again because this is all self reported and this is all coming from an online application. All of this is data, and so it can be easily manipulated by the schools to move around and be kind of presented to the reader in a way that makes the most sense to them.
So they’re going to pull it out by section. So kind of don’t worry about kind of doing that on your own. You can if you want to, but it’s fine. But I would say, yeah, broadly, you know. Perhaps start with the things that are more, um, relevant to you, uh, things that you’re most proud of. So the reader sees those kind of, you know, first in each section, um, but they will all be presented kind of in those different breakouts in essence.
Stacey: Great. That’s really helpful. Um, the next set of questions are about being homeschooled, um, and applying to UCs. What is your experience? What advice do you have? For individuals who are homeschooled and applying to the UC system.
Aaron: Yeah, so technically they’re, yeah, it’s a little bit complicated, but doable.
We had homeschooled applications every year, and many of them were admitted, um, they, so the UC overall has very kind of strict requirements for admission in terms of GPA, whether you’re in state or out of state, and curricular requirements, because they want you to take a very prescribed program. College preparatory curriculum in high school again, those A through G requirements that you may have heard of, or that I mentioned a couple of times in the presentation there is, however, a process if a student.
Has not technically met the minimum requirements, but the rest of their application is otherwise compelling that you can do something called admit by exception or a bye, um, and there are certain amounts, uh, essentially, each campus is allowed a certain percentage of a by admits every year, um, which we never even came close to hitting at UCSD because.
Most students have had done them all. Um, so it gives you flexibility to kind of advocate for students who perhaps don’t have the exact requirements ready, but otherwise present a compelling application. Um, and there are other ways to meet A through G without high school coursework. It can be college coursework and the exams that you’ve taken.
Um, I would suggest, uh, as a homeschooled student or parent, um, look at what’s called the UC Quick Reference Guide for Counselors, which is a PDF available online to anybody, um, it is, despite being called a quick reference, it is 75 pages long, uh, in true public school fashion, uh, but it has a lot of information about different ways that you can meet, um, The admissions eligibility requirements and there is a section there about homeschooled students.
So I’d encourage you to take a look at that.
Stacey: Great. Um, that was really helpful as well. And, you know, more niche question within the homeschooling question. If you have dual enrollment courses, you report those as college courses taken. I would imagine a not high school regular courses, right?
Aaron: Yeah, so essentially, if you’re taking them to fulfill high school graduation requirements, um, but you are taking it at a college campus, you’ll say, yes, it’s a college level course because they want you to obviously be, you know, kind of get the credit that you deserve for taking a college level course, um, in terms of the rigor.
That that entailed, but as long as you haven’t yet graduated from high school, yes, it’s kind of an essence considered as part of your high school application, but you should indicate that it was taken at a college that it’s a college level course.
Stacey: Great. That’s exactly what we needed to know there. If.
Art, a school doesn’t have a traditional grading system. I know you talked earlier about maybe including that in the additional information section. Um, how should you report your grades, self report your grades? Should you be trying to translate those to an A through F traditional grading system, or should you report it just as it shows up on your transcript?
Aaron: Yeah, I mean, I would say like, you know, if you’re at a school that, you know, offers just kind of a different system, there, there are many common systems that the UC application includes in the kind of drop down when you select the GPA scale. So, you know, A through F, you have, you know, 1 to 4, 1 to 7, and if you’re an IB school, 0 to 100.
So there are plenty of kind of non just A through F systems. Scales in the application already. Um, you know, if your school has a fairly unique one, you know, you’re at like a New England boarding school. That’s like, we’re going to be different and have like 1 to 6 because we can, um, yeah, maybe put that in the academic comments section, um, just so that the reader is aware.
Uh, of that, the ones, you know, if you’re a school that’s truly narrative evaluation where there is no grade whatsoever, um, then I might suggest reaching out directly to the campus, um, to which you are interested in applying, um, to see what they might recommend go there. Otherwise, you should be able to put it in and then perhaps make a comment on it in the application for the reader.
Stacey: Great. Yeah, that’s that’s really helpful. I know there’s I haven’t gotten quite a few students who have non traditional grading system. So that advice goes a long way. I do want to take a second now to talk about a unique opportunity here at CollegeAdvisor. Um, so you can get your essays reviewed in 72 hours or less using these packages that we have available.
You can ensure your essays stand out by using these packages when applying to college. And this is leveraging our CollegeAdvisor.com essay review team. It’s typically Designed for seniors in the thick of their application process. So these are essays that you’re going to be submitting actively now, and they give you the opportunity to receive quick unbiased and expert reviews of your essays from members of our team and our experienced admissions experts like myself and Aaron will evaluate your essays for strength of topic, grammar, structure, diction, and narrative flow.
And they’ll also look at how your essays contribute to your overall candidate profile and suggest a few things. specific ways to make that stronger. So you can purchase these packages using the QR code here on the slide. Um, and I’m going to put the direct link here in the chat as well. Um, so you all can see that, um, in case the QR code does not work for you.
Um, and that’s also the QR code is going to stay on. The next slide for your quick reference. So back to the Q and a, um, let’s see, I have a question about recommendation letters. And just to reiterate, the, you see, is don’t require recommendation letters at the onset, but then later may request those.
Aaron: Yeah, so, um, for the vast majority of students, we’re talking about 95 or more percent, no recommendation letters.
They don’t ask for them. If you submit them, they will not review them. They will say thank you and immediately put them in the trash. Um, there is, for a very small subset of students, um, something called supplemental review. Which again is one of the processes delineated by that kind of state control oversight board, where if there’s something kind of going on in the application that is just like really significant hardship that a student’s face that may have impacted their academic performance, uh, you’re looking at a trend in grades, um, something that just kind of like the reader has questions about that weren’t answered and the student is otherwise a kind of compelling applicant.
They might. Put you forward into this process called supplemental review, where they would then ask for your fall senior year grades, and those are the only students where that would be the case where they would ask for fall senior year grades, and then they may also then as part of that ask for someone to kind of speak on your behalf, but it kind of again from from a Standpoint of clarifying things or asking about you.
Hey, the student mentioned this particular challenge. Can you elaborate on that for us while also giving the student an opportunity to kind of talk about those things as well. So so there can be, um, a possibility of someone speaking on your behalf. You can’t ask for it. It only is something that the reader kind of Reads and notices and then puts forward and it’s a fairly Small subset of the applicant pool that will will have that opportunity
Stacey: Perfect.
Thank you so much Let’s actually pivot now to talk a little bit about financial aid and scholarships if you’re applying to the UC’s I know that this is a hot topic. It’s um, very challenging to advise students who are not in California applying to the UC so Aaron any insight both For those within California and outside of California for considerations on the financial aid and scholarship front.
Aaron: Yeah, um, so I guess we’ll start with the you know, the good news and the bad news, right? So the good news for Californians, there’s significant states, um, and institutional aid available, um, both in the form of scholarships and of course in financial aid. So there’s a couple of different things that you should do.
Um, there’s the Cal Grants application. Um, that has already started. So if you’re a senior and you haven’t done that, um, it might be too late now. Uh, check with your counselor. If you’re a junior or younger, then just have that in kind of forefront of your mind for next fall. And that Cal Grant award is quite significant.
It’s about 12,000 a year and it’s tied to UC tuition. So as tuition rises, so does the Cal Grant award. Of course, if you submit, um, a FAFSA and you are eligible for federal grants and you can get things like Pell, right? Um, Then you also can apply for institutional aid. And so there might be grant aid, um, loans, work study, et cetera, that come from the institution specifically.
So for Californians, there are plenty of funding opportunities such that the cost of attendance, hopefully is not a barrier that prevents you from enrolling. Um, they will also consider California students automatically for a whole host of merit based scholarships. There is in fact, um, Page in the application where you can kind of go through and select all the scholarships you wish to be considered for and that you think you may be eligible for.
There’s also some very high level scholarships, like the regents and chancellors scholarships at each institution that typically go to kind of the top end of their pool. And that can be some fairly significant value. So, um, you know, that’s the good news for out of state international. It’s definitely much more limited.
Um, of course, you’re eligible for any sort of federal aid. Um, so, you know, if you fill out a FAFSA and you’re eligible for Pell, you can get that, um, but pretty much the bulk of everything else is going to come from the family, um, or from the student. There are some. Out of state merit based scholarships, but that funding kind of fluctuates from year to year, partially due to the political climate.
Um, yeah, so when I was there, we did have some funding for international students or not international. Well, more out of state domestic, they may not have that anymore because there’s kind of been a pendulum swing back towards preferring Californians with state money. As you might imagine, right? I mean, they’re paid for by California taxpayers.
So then they turn around and say, well, my tax dollars supporting a student applying from, uh, Colorado politically, that’s not super feasible. So unfortunately, if you’re a very high need student and you are applying from out of state, I was always pretty honest with students and saying, I didn’t think that was going to be the best choice.
Stacey: so much. Yeah, that’s not an easy answer to give. So I really appreciate that overview. I’m sure everybody in the room does too. Um, there’s definitely a lot of nuances to financial aid and scholarship applications and you see the UC system is very unique in its approach. So thank you so much for that overview.
Now, Aaron, when students are submitting their academic information, do the UC schools receive high school profiles from guidance counselors in the same way as Common App and Coalition App? Um, what does that look like? How, how do admissions officers familiarize themselves with the high schools that students are applying from?
Aaron: They don’t. Um, so again, that’s why it’s important that students in the kind of education history section in the application. You know, accurately, um, represents kind of how the, that works, um, and then use that additional comments section for the academics to kind of talk about anything like that because there isn’t really an opportunity to submit a profile.
There is some data that they will receive directly from that each institution will receive directly from UCOP, um, from out of state. For out of state students, especially for schools that send a lot of applications to the UC, where they’ve kind of collected that information and kind of create their own sort of version of the school profile to give to the reader, obviously, the schools within California, um, that’s all very much readily available because of just the immense amount of data that the UC system has that they provide, um, so in some ways it’s incumbent on, you know, the admissions office Readers, you know, for out of state, like they’re traveling, they’re visiting schools, um, you know, just like many private schools are.
And so they kind of get to know the area, um, and can really speak to the students kind of qualifications in the appropriate context. But, you know, again, use all the pieces of. The application to be your best self advocate. So, you know, if your school has unique offerings or requirements or restrictions, um, that you feel that the readers may not know about, especially if you’re out of state, put that in the application, uh, use that space available to you.
Stacey: Wonderful. Um. Another related question to finances and financial aid and support, is there a fee waiver for the Cal UC system? Is there a way to apply for an application fee waiver or discount?
Aaron: It’s pretty much applied automatically. So that question that I asked about, or the question that I mentioned where it asks for your family income.
Basically, if your income is a certain level and it’s a sliding scale based on the size of your household, it will automatically apply a fee waiver.
Stacey: Oh, wonderful. That’s great information for the applicants. Um, another question that came through the pre registration. Was about international considerations.
I know you talked briefly about the IELTS, um, maybe English speaking ability gauges, anything else that international students should take into consideration when applying to the UC system?
Aaron: Uh, broadly, it’s very similar. I mean, kind of, again, the components of the application are Are all going to be the same, just reviewed in the international context.
And so it’s usually by a team of specialized readers who have extensive knowledge and background and training in international systems, um, and kind of limitations that students may face or kind of what is standard from a certain country. Um, basically the only thing that’s different is again, proof of English language ability.
Where they’re looking at, if you did not go to a school that was taught in English for at least three years, then you must submit results from TOEFL, IELTS, or the Duolingo English test. Or again, potentially SAT or ACT scores if you have a qualifying score for, um, you know, the evidence based reading and writing or the English section of the SAT or ACT.
Outside of that, it’s pretty much the same admissions process. It just also is the case that international and out of state domestic students are kind of reviewed in a separate pool. Um, so it’s almost like there’s two admissions processes, one for Californians and one for out of state students. State and international students.
Um, so it often is a bit more competitive, uh, for out of state and international students, especially in recent years as, um, the state, there’s been a lot of kind of political discussions around UC. And so, um, UCLA, Berkeley and San Diego, which had been the kind of largest destinations for out of state international students, um, we’re told they had to reduce out of state and international enrollment, um, to increase California enrollment, um, and we’re given some financial kind of, you know, Compensation from the state to do so.
So basically we’re like, okay, we’ll do that, but we’re losing revenue. So you’ve got to give it to us from the state. And they did, uh, which then means that they have cut a lot of spots for out of state and international students.
Stacey: That that’s really helpful to know. And actually there’s a relevant question in the chat, um, in this regard.
Do in state students get priority, um, during the admissions process for the UC system?
Aaron: So, I guess, you know, the super helpful admissions answer is, it depends. Um, which was one of my favorite things to say, um, and least favorite for a student or family to hear. Um, in review, No, in the sense that you’re kind of reviewed in the same way, right?
Like, you’re looking at the same kind of guidelines, it’s the same scoring, the two blind reads, everything is read the same, but then turning around and deciding, okay, now that a student is scored, how are they going to be admitted or not? Yes, in that way, Californians have a priority. And not that it’s like they fill the class first, and then it’s just that there’s a certain percentage that they kind of have.
Okay, this is going to be our percentage of California students. Um, you know, but at the places that are the most competitive, it’s still crazy competitive, even if you’re in state two. I mean, the in state admit rate for UCLA this last year was 9%, and Berkeley was 14. So it’s not like it’s that much easier to get in as a Californian.
Stacey: Right, right, right. And you know, the quotas that you’re talking about, you know, the demographics that UC schools are trying to hit, it’s not uncommon for that to be true at other schools, state schools as well. Um, and so it’s important for those in the room today to, you know, understand that that’s actually quite a common consider, uh, university consideration, especially state level schools across the United States.
So,
Aaron: I had to tell a lot of my students who are applying to UVA,
Stacey: Probably
Aaron: not going to work.
Stacey: Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I hear you. Um, so another question I had for you has to do with, um, you know, visiting the UC’s, um, reaching out to admissions officers, having those touch points. Do the UC’s take notice of demonstrated interest?
Aaron: No, absolutely not. So, uh, yeah, they’re happy to hear from you. If you have a question, all of them have, you know, really robust campus visit and tour programs to try and, you know, show you what life is like for the student on their campus. But it’s it’s solely for your informational purposes. Yes, they track it all.
But again, it’s more for them to understand. Is it working or not? Are they doing a good job? But it’s not like tied to your individual record and looking at it in the way they’re like, Oh, this student came on a tour. That’s going to help them in the application.
Stacey: Got it. Okay. That makes sense. Um, I want to touch briefly on the PAQs before we wrap up, um, in your experience, are there topics that, and I know you talked, it was really helpful to hear about kind of what admissions officers like to see in terms of direct responses.
Are there other things that students should avoid when answering those PAQs? Any other tips on what to avoid? Um, and to wrap up, I’d love to hear maybe, um, one of your favorite essays that you’ve ever read, if you could think of, or favorite topics that you’ve read, if you can think of them. So kind of two parts.
What would you suggest avoiding? And, um, are there any essays that really stood out to you over the years?
Aaron: Um, I think similar in some level to kind of the common app personal statement, it’s less about entire wholesale topics to avoid and more about kind of, well, Within certain topics that might be more commonly discussed, how do you do it in a way that is, um, I don’t want to say unique because that’s not the purpose, but just got it.
Does it get the point across? Does it do its job? Does the reader learn about you? So, you know, talking about like the way that the P. I. Q. S are are kind of set up is that they are very specific prompts. And so you do want to very Clearly address the prompt. Um, and so say like the leadership one, oftentimes students will talk about sports there and that’s totally fine because there’s plenty of amazing leadership opportunities for sports.
Um, but just make sure that it’s, it’s something beyond just like, I learned about teamwork and, and, you know, as captain, I, I ran stretches or something, but like, you know, again, what’s the, the kind of takeaway there. Um, you know, Similarly, like making impact in a community. Right. How have you made your community a better place is one of the questions.
Um, and you know, being able to talk about mission trips or service trips to communities less fortunate than yours in a way that is mature, um, is I think sometimes the challenge, uh, and you would definitely see a lot of responses that kind of veered towards the, Oh, I saw poor people could be happy too.
And it just, It’s not really coming across in a way that perhaps you, you meant it to, um, in terms of like positive ones, uh, there are plenty, uh, that I think, you know, kind of run the gamut, um, from the different responses, which is what I like kind of reading for the UC’s is that you do have those eight different prompts and students choose different ones and.
I tended to personally prefer, but again, this is in no way like indicative of like an overall view from the UC, but, um, the one about like an academic interest, um, because you are applying to an academic place, right? You’re going to college for four years. And, um, That was a really interesting place to hear about like for kids to just like nerd out and say like I’m really interested in this idea, um, and kind of explain that and that I just always found fun because I got to learn something too oftentimes, um, in reading those, which is really fun.
Stacey: Yeah, I think actually that might be one of my favorites to read as well. So I think that’s Um, not at all a means of saying that’s the one you need to choose. Um, you should choose the ones that you feel like you can answer your, to the best of your ability. But definitely, um, one of my favorites as well.
Alright, so with that, I want to thank everyone for coming out tonight, including Erin, our panelist. Um, I learned so much. so much. That is the end of our webinar. We had a really great time telling you all about finalizing your University of California applications. And here is our November webinar series in case you want to join us for some upcoming sessions.
We have some great sessions, including one tomorrow on Harvard supplements. Um, next week I’ll be giving a webinar on Yale supplements. So please be sure to join me for that. Um, there’s an MIT supplement session as well towards the end of the month. Um, and we hope you all have a great night. Thank you, Aaron.
Aaron: Thank you. Bye, everyone.
Stacey: Bye.